The Slow Suicide Of Internet Marketing

By Mark / February 1, 2013

businesmanI wrote an email to some of my subscribers this week about how I thought that Internet marketing was essentially broken. Several things have happened over the past few weeks that have made me take a long look at the IM business (Again!) and once again I don’t like what I see. It seems that a lot of marketers are set on a path of self destruction.

 

First let me preface this by saying that I love Internet marketing, I love the fact that I can sit and my desk have an idea , create something and earn money. I love that I can find a great product write a review and make commission.  I love that I can have an idea for a website and within an hour have a site up and ready to make sales.

I love that the there are very few barriers to entry and anyone can make an income. Viva La Revolution!

I honestly still get a buzz from opening my email and finding I’ve made a sale of $9.

I’ve not had a job in the past 33 years of my working life that has brought me as much pleasure on a daily basis as IM, yet not a day goes by when I don’t find something about it that makes despair for the future.

So here are 7 reasons why I think Internet Marketing is broken.

 

1. Jumping On The Merry Go Round

Twenty marketers emailing you promoting the same product and trying to differentiate their offers by adding more and more valuable bonus’s .

 

It’s really time to do the maths on this one, if you are competing to make sales with almost every big name marketer with a list then you might make some sales and earn $150 commission per sale but it you put the same effort into marketing a product that paid you far less commission and had far fewer people promoting then 2 things would happen you’d make more sales  but more importantly you wouldn’t lose subscribers.

Hands up who unsubscribes from multiple lists if you get multiple promotional emails from different marketers.

During the Easy Video Suite launch I had emails from marketers who had never created or sold a Video related product promote it to me. WHY?

If I can look at it and decide that it’s not a particularly good fit for my subscribers who have bought videos related products why can’t they?

 

2. Lack of originality

Marketers do what they see other people doing, they completely disregard trying anything new. A great example is a marketer who builds a list then see’s other more successful marketers emailing offers everyday. So they start to email offers every day even though they complain about getting so many email offers.

 

3. Failure to build a proper business.

This is related to number 2 . If you aren’t creating products and just promoting other peoples products you haven’t got a business. Relying on short term income over long term profits is a recipe for disaster.

 

4. A Fundamental Lack of Original Thought

Rehashing other people ideas and products. A few weeks ago I explained how I had done something in a private group within 3 days I was being asked by another member to promote his product about exactly the same method. Coincidence?

 

5. JV partners Dictating the Sales Process

When Jv partners want 100% commission on the front end and expect you to have a high process backend One Time Offer then something is broken!  Have a look through the warrior forum and look at what buyers ask in every thread .. is there an OTO.  Customers don’t like it yet marketers feel like they have to do it.

I actually don’t believe there is anything wrong in offering an OTO that compliments a product, but you should not be forced into having one if you don’t want to have one. On the other hand an OTO that provides a missing pecs of the puzzle that should have been in the original product is totally wrong.

 

6. Stupidity

Sellers who don’t give out review copies but still want you to promote their offer…  nothing more to say on this one apart from .. Muppets!

 

7. A complete and utter lack of common sense.

Too many marketers are focussed on the making quick cash and not planning for long term income. They view their subscribers not as customers but as cash dispensers. This is what bankrupts businesses in everyday life and IM is no different.

In fact everything i’ve written here can be attributed to not having a grasp of basic business practices. Wouldn’t it make IM a much better place if you were forced to complete a course on basic marketing skills and customer services before they were allowed to set up a website or create an email list.

Most of the things that are wrong with this gloriously inclusive business would be solved by marketers asking themselves ..

“What would be in my customers best interest”

Try it it might transform you business.

 

About the author

Mark

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47 comments
Kevin Ashbridge

What a great article, Mark. I agree with you on every point. I got totally sick of the avalanche of “Best Bonus” offers around the EVS launch. And, to be honest, I only buy my WSO’s via a few marketers I trust – and that’s the point. These marketers are “authority figures” and mentors to me; I am in their various programs and have bought their own products. So VERY FEW of the other marketers whose lists I’m on bother to build that relationship with me. Few are adding value to my interaction with them, many are making the quick buck.

I also have a pet peeve with a few well known marketer who for many months promoted only a few select offers they ‘believed in/bought themselves’, then suddenly its a WSO-a-day. It’s like, “now I can afford an army of VAs to scrape the Warrior Forum, I’m going to milk my list dry”.
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Jim Cottone

This sounds very much like life itself. If you don’t understand that treating others with respect and almost treating them like your immediate family is the way to go then all I can say is good luck with that. Treating people like they are cattle in a slaughter line might make you a nickel but you will never reach true long term success.
Jim Cottone recently posted..Self DisciplineMy Profile

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Garry Sayer

Great post, Mark. Really enjoyed reading it. I found myself nodding my head in agreement as I read each paragraph.

I agree some marketers need to do a course in basic marketing and customer service before they even think about creating their first site. I’m lucky I come from a hospitality background where looking after customers, and often exceeding their needs, is paramount. Some marketers are clueless at doing this and seem to have a disparaging and condescending attitude towards their customers.

During the initial pre-launch phase of EVS I was quite excited about buying it. By the time it approached launch time (and after launch) I got so fed up with the relentless emails dropping into my inbox, as well as the confusing and overwhelmng “bonus” packages, that the whole launch left me cold. I ended up not buying.

Concerning OTOs I think affiliates have so much influence and control over the success or failure of a launch. And ultimately the only thing they’re interested in is high EPCs. Many don’t give a crap about the quality of the product itself and often don’t even ask for a copy – I know this from being a member of several Skype groups.. So unfortunately as a product creator if we want affiliates on board we need to create an OTO to bump the affiliates earnings. I generally opt for a product bundle at a discounted price and find that works well, it keeps the affiliates and customers happy. But an OTO that contains the missing pieces of the frontend offer is just downright cheeky and shows a lack of respect for your customers!
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Shane Reply:

I gotta say, that’s not quite my experience with affiliates and promotions.

It’s true that there are many affiliates who don’t much care about the quality of what they promote. There are also many who can’t really discern between good and great products that well.

But when it comes to promoting something, I think the number one factor is who you’re connected to. The EPC becomes important once you gain some momentum. Affiliates will hesitate if they see low EPC and are more likely to jump on board if they see high EPC, but only once they see other affiliates promoting.
And upsells are not strictly needed for great EPC.

To get that initial group of affiliates promoting, you need connections. It’s much more important who you know and who knows you than what the specifics of your offer are.

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Tom

excellent post! I unsubscribe every time someone sends me three marketing e-mails in a row. I also unsubscribe when I keep getting e-mails with no useful information. I have a limited amount of time and actually I have to whittle down the people I subscribe to as I am spending too much time going through my e-mails every day.

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shane

Mark, you need to get off of the Warrior Forum.

The WF and all the circles surrounding it (including the WF knock-off forums) only seem big from the inside and to me, it’s clear that you don’t belong there.

A few years ago, I spent quite a lot of time on the WF as well. And I thought it was big. And I saw all the IM launches and the WSOs etc. and that shaped the way I thought about online marketing and the marketing niche. And I realized I don’t belong there, at all.

And luckily, I also realized that WF and Co are not a big part of the marketing niche. They’re just one tiny little corner. And really: they’re the bad neighborhood.

I know you’re aware of this, but it seems to me that you’re still subjecting yourself to this crowd much too often.
Unless you feel you can somehow change it or you being annoyed about it is a vital part of your brand, I can only recommend taking a wider view. Look at startups, service and software-service companies, ecommerce,… there’s so much happening in the marketing niche that is nothing like what goes on on the WF.
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Mark
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Hi Shane, My last 3 launches have avoided the Warrior forum…

When i talk to marketers who do launches and promote stuff there, they all want to get away from there, when you tell them well Ok promote this it’s aimed at a completely different market… what happens .. they don’t promote..

C’est la vie

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Shane Reply:

Haha, that’s amusingly tragic. So people have somehow trapped themselves in the WF?

Actually, I’m not sure if I should laugh or cry, about that…

But I see what you mean. When you’re reaching into a new market segment, you have to build from scratch and that’s pretty difficult.

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Steve Hards

Spot-on Mark!

And other people would have converted it into an ‘Oh-My-Gosh-Death-Of-Internet-Marketing!!!!!!!’ report 🙂

By the way, has anyone managed to successfully unsubscribe from the list of ‘the other’ Mark Thompson – the one in the States?

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Fred Ferguson
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Steve I can tell you The “Mark Thompson” that you’re talking about is a Pirate when it comes to marketing ethics – for him the rules are just suggestions!

I bought a once (Hype Product) but I have unsubscribed more times from him than I can tell you yet still occasionally, over a year later, I get (unauthorized) emails from him. The part I don’t get is… he makes ZERO from me.

I’d rather set my money on fire than see a dime of it get into that guy’s pocket!!!

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Bill (LoneWolf) Nickerson
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I just realized this week that there were two Mark Thompsons! I was wondering at some of the promotions that were coming through since the didn’t seem to line up with Mark’s philosophy. Then I noticed that the address was based out of the US, not Spain.

I unsubscribed, but it’s too early to tell for sure.
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Mark
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A lot of people get confused by there being 2 mark Thompsons.. I was here first 🙂

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Ed Kangai
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I’ve certainly been stunningly unsucessful in seeking to get off the other Mark Thompson’s list. It makes me wonder whether it’s actually possible! As for WF I visit and try to help out with newbie questions. There are one or two folks like Alexa Smith whose content usually seems good. Rob Cortez, one or two others but I tread gingerly over there. In passing I’ll mention that I was – to put this in an excruciatingly nice way – a touch disappointed with one of my recent purchases there. To others who’re disappointed, I really do understand
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JohnTheJock

10/10 for this post Mark.

I recently unsubscribed from more than a dozen lists because I was being bombarded with the same WSO’s on a daily basis.

I think some marketers should take a break and then go back to basics – providing quality!

I’m not looking forward to the next generation of Interne Marketing wannabes.

Thanks again, with you all the way,

John.
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art williams

I agree with each of your points…some more than others. But I especially am sick of the same crap from 7-9 different gurus especially when their emails are so cheesy. I have unsubscribed to a LOT of these guys over the last month. A LOT lot. I also development an immediate disregard and disrespect for people on the WF who have OTO’s. I honestly can say I hate them just on general principle. Many, many time I’ve bought a product only to be very unpleasantly surprised to see there’s a OTO. If the product is so damn good, it ought to be complete. I really, really dislike being treated like a moron that would fall for the usual OTO pitch.

I’ve also come to respect the Warrior Forum a lot less from the stupid and consistently repetitive yet totally content-less testimonials. All a bunch of Martha Stewart of Ed McMahon wannabees saying everything but saying nothing that really counts. I’ve noticed that it’s VERY, very rare for somebody to say in a WF testimonial that they’ve made money with a particular product.

The WF is almost becoming like one of those streets that every city has where it’s all used car, tote-the-note dealers for a mile or two. In Houston, where I’m from, that would be like in Pasadena or along Telephone Road. Total trash.

Regards,
art williams

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Stevie

Thank you very much for your post, Mark, like you, I really love the IM and I fully agree with you and learned so much from you.
Two primary things I think are important for the stability of a good long-term business: originality and value.
If I can’t give out these to subscribers, I can hardly go on.
Thanks again for sharing.
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Bill Allen

I agree with pretty much everything you wrte in this. It’s a shame, but I think IM might be eating it’s own tail as well. And actually I think it has mostly to do with mindset.

For people coming into IM thinking long term, real business, actually adding something still seem to do well though. And for the opposite reasons you state above. I mean, if you have a long term…”I will create a real business” mentality, then you are obviously going to try to improve on things, expand your mind, sit down and learn what it takes to create and run a business…you know, like actually learn how to build a site if you need one, learn to write copy, come up with new, interesting and helpful products, understand a bit on accounting, cash flow, etc…

But that’s a lot of work, right? I mean, why learn about something that can not just change your life, but others as well? Heck, even change YOU as a person in every aspect of your life. It’s so much easier to go to work everyday and keep your head down and collect those few hundered dollar a week paychecks, right?

Again, mindset. That’s the key IMHO. Read books like the Compound Effect or The Slight Edge and you’d be amazed at what you can do. One step back to get two (or more) steps forward. It’s not hard, it’s not easy, it’s simply a choice. Either way, life is moving you forward…it’s just in which direction?

Cheers!
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Isabel

Hey there Mark, I will boost your ego and agree with you 110%… I totally agree on good customer relations is the bread and butter of your profit margins.

If you are doing offline marketing, that is or should be any marketers question to the business as such. ‘Do you know your customer’s lifetime value?’ Once we calculate this and more times than not, a big aha! moment happens whereby both the consultant and business owner is eager to do anything in their power to retain a high standard so as to elongate their stay with the business.

So that being said, why is it not applied by all IMers? I believe is the ‘quick-cash’ syndrome and if it works in dribs and drabs then perhaps later they will focus on the ‘real business’, which never happens because they are too embroiled on dribs and drabs so there is little time to do anything else. Yes, we know…
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Brad

I have already unsubscribed from half a dozen marketers I used to have respect for. The constant buy this and get my 37 free bonuses. And clogging my inbox all the time. It’s all about Karma

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Mike Jones

You have read my mind. I am so fed up with receiving multiple emails promoting the same products and cluttering up mail. As fast as I unsubscribe, I seem to receive more multiple hits. Also, the OTO struck a very raw nerve.
Great post, you hit it on the head!

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Paul Nicholls Blog

Hey Mark

Many of these are things that I often think about on a regular basis too.

One of the things that I often say is the more people that just spam and hammer
their lists to death and market badly and provide no value in their market place the
easier it is to succeed and build a reputation of being one of the good guys because there
are so many bad ones.

I often visit other IM blogs mark and the amount of rubbish I see is unreal. So many of them
just have review after review of other IM products as their blog posts. Again this is probably
because so many other IM blogs do this they think it’s the right way to do things.

Paul
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Joe

I couldn’t have said it better myself, although I’ve thought the same thing! I buy something I think will help me in my endeavors, and get daily promotions until I unsubscribe.

It’s refreshing to see a few, like you , who finally get it.

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Colin

“Wouldn’t it make IM a much better place if you were forced to complete a course on basic marketing skills and customer services before they were allowed to set up a website or create an email list.”

While I agree with your sentiment on this Mark, like with the majority of professions in the UK, IM would be regulated by quangos who know nothing of the business but there to make a quick buck from crap training and so-called ‘qualifications’.

I have witnessed this in my industry (plumbing and heating) and the effects of very poor training and calamitous regulation by UK quangos during the past 10 years are just beginning to reverberate with serious consequences.

I feel if IM was regulated in the UK through compulsory training etc then this area of business would also be detrimentally affected or possibly destroyed in the long run. Keep IM free of outside influence and burdens!

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Mark
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I don’t think i’d go as far a government regulation!

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Colin Reply:

Mark, forcing people to complete a basic course would require regulation – this something I would never want to see in as it would be a obstacle to many IM beginners.

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Bill (LoneWolf) Nickerson
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I agree. Having to force someone to toe any line adds red tape and associated costs, whether it’s government or not.

Just think about how many bad lawyers, doctors, etc there are out there despite the regulations in place. It really doesn’t solve any of the problems.

I think a better approach is to encourage one another to do a better job and educate the public on what they should be looking for when dealing online.
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Vic Daly

Hi Mark,

Re: The Slow Suicide of Internet Marketing

I really enjoyed reading your above post, and all I can say is that I have to agree wholeheartedly with you.

I also think that Tom of treebar483 comment has the best way of dealing with these perpetual posters.

All I need to do is get my own house in order now and follow Tom’s actions.

The trouble is we always seem to think we are going to miss something by unsubscribing, when in fact if we just got on with our own affairs we would be far better off, than waiting for some magic bullet to solve all our problems.

We are the problem we allow them into our in-boxes.

Yes, if the information these people send us was of interest, great… BUT not to plague their list with affiliate offers that are doing the rounds all over the net.

The trouble is when you buy their products and you sign-up for up-dates that’s when the messy stuff hits the fan, from that moment on you are plagued with anything they can lay their grubby affiliate hands on.

Vic
Spain
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Peter

Great blog post Mark and can I add my growing “hate” for the free webinar. Every different marketer thinks their list has 2 hours to waste to be “pitched to” at the very end. They think that their list can conform to their timing and if you don’t make the “call” you have 48 hours to watch their dribble or the opportunity is gone….more and more I am saying take your opportunity and disappear!!!
What happened to the marketer that was concerned for their customer, that serves up their information to their customers time and time constraints. With technology today why can’t a webinar be broken up into chapters so you can rewatch the parts that you want…the beginning…the concept…the product…the pitch.
If your product won’t stand up to such scrutiny then you are selling for your gain not your customer’s.
Let it be known that you probably have lost this customer

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Paul Forcey

I used a OTO for the first time ever with my latest product and it made sense as they were both aimed at the same thing while not being the same tool.

The OTO converted well and I have had 0 refunds (touch wood) so the product was obviously right for the market.

When you are giving 100% on the FE you need to have a Back End to make some money back, sure you can offer 100% throughout and just build a list but then you have to mail them selling stuff reasonably fast.

One thing I find about lists is that you get a hard core that will buy everything you sell or promote, that makes me feel even more responsible for what I send them.

The one that is driving me nuts at the moment is people selling products that are not complete. I bought a Facebook product recently from a big name, all about putting a Facebook page together and making money from it.

The product didn’t show you how to make a timeline cover, it didn’t show you how to pick a niche and it gave the most basic info on Facebook ads I have ever seen. Yet it is a best seller..
Paul Forcey recently posted..February Already?My Profile

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Mark
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Paul, the question is why do you feel that you have to do 100% commission for your product? You know it’s good, I know it’s good. It’s a good fit for many peoples list.

So why can’t JV partners just accept that if a product is good for their lists then they should promote it regardless of whether it pays them 100% or 50% .. the commission level they get should be a minor consideration.

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Alex Newell

So where is the proof of IM being broken?

I missed it!

You had a nice rant about the “muppets” who inhabit a lot of forums at present and these guys do make things much harder for beginners.

I detest these guys and unsubscribe instantly from anyone who promotes crap.

But the model of ethical IM is not broken. I think rather that there are more marketers nowadays standing out in public – marketing honestly.

It’s not just you – there’s Tiffany Dow, Shane Melaugh, Andrew Hansen, Erika Stone, Veit Schenk, Paul Evans, Lynn Terry…

I could bore you with a long list of superb ethical IMers.

Maybe you should spend less time at the WF Mark?

🙂

I also disagree with you about the proposition that you have to be a product creator. There’s plenty of room for merchants and affiliates and tons of affiliates who get rich and stay richer promoting Amazon and other products.
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Shane Reply:

Thanks for the mention, Alex!

Although I will join Mark in saying that you should be a product creator. So much easier… 🙂
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Mark
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Alex, you make some good points, but you seem to be assuming that i am referring to the Warrior Forum.. I’m not.

My last WSO was launched a year ago yesterday , (For the sake of full disclousure I have created 2 products for other people to market, one was a wso 6 months ago the other wasn’t).

Also just because a product is sold via a WSO it doesn’t mean it not good far from it, there are some superb products released there every month

I am fully aware that there are a lot of 100% ethical marketers I spend a lot of time taling to them about how we can Improve the marketplace and provide quality information for our subscribers.

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Ingrid

I am not big into the IM niche, however I do affiliate marketing and try to market ethically. I am on a couple of marketers list and just yesterday I told myself that I need to unsubscribe from some of these marketers. Reason? I am getting tired of them all promoting the same products to me over and over again. They all come with their different must have bonuses and I wonder if these people even think about what they are doing. Everyday I get 4 or five emails from the same people selling different products. It is really becoming ridiculous. I would think they would try to limit the amount of product they try to sell to any one person over a one week period. It really is becoming ridiculous.

I so agree with you Mark, they are killing IM.

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Mike Long

Mark,

While I normally agree 100% with pretty much everything you say, I will take a somewhat opposing view regarding the creation of your own products. While I agree that having at least one product to call your own is essential from the standpoint of creating your own, unique POV in the market, it would be crazy for me to try and re-create some “landmark” products out there.

A few products come to mind:

1. Tiny Little Businesses
2. Autoresponder Madness
3. WP Goldmine Forum 😉

In each instance, the above products are so good, and so well established, that I would be foolish to try and create a competing product. It makes far more sense for me to promote those products, which have stood the test of time and will likely be around for years to come. They do what they do better than I could ever do it on my own.

With that said, I do agree that there is ample room for creating my own products to fill in perceived gaps in my overall marketing POV.

Bottom line, it’s about quality. If I think I can create a product that is better than anything else currently available, it makes sense to do that. But if there are top-shelf products already out there that cover the exact things I want to share, then creating my own potentially inferior version of it isn’t the way to best help my list members and customers.

-Mike

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Andrew Peacock

I’m with you Mark. I’ve been reading a few bits of material that are striking a chord with me: your 500 buyers report, Autoresponder Madness, and some others I can’t remember the names of.

As such, I’ve actually thought about this whole year and mapped out my product/project roadmap, making sure that each one planned has some point of leverage with the others. Sometimes that leverage for me (product X gives me the capability to sell products Y and Z), sometimes they are leverage for the customer.

I’m doing all this as I’m sick of my own “chasing my own tail” approach to releasing product after product (been there, done that, started to slide into it again), and being subject to the product after product mails from people I would otherwise consider to be great product developers.

The other thing getting to me – slightly off topic – is the people who launch a product via their “big name” launch partners, and only then open the affiliate program up to other affiliates. I’ve seen a slow increase in these. My opinion obviously being “I think your product is well-suited to hard-earned mailing list, so I’ll promote it 3 weeks after A) they’ve already bought it via your preferred affiliates, or B) they’re sick of hearing about it and so unsubscribe from my list because I’m buying into the EPC hype as well…. Thanks. Make sure to close the door on the way out.”

(On another note, just between the Website and comment box on your form, there’s a checkbox with no text to describe what it does…)

Andy

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Bill (LoneWolf) Nickerson

Great points Mark. I don’t know if there is anything we can do about what others do other than expose them. Not sure how well that would work. I’m sure that would turn into to another negative crapfest.

I think that the most important thing we can do is try our best to work with integrity. Promote products that you create yourself. Promote products that you believe would be a benefit to your list. Treat your list members with respect. Give generously and support one another.

Educating people about how to buy online is another thing that could help. The bad apples so often affect the way our potential customers view us. The tar brush swings pretty wide. If people knew what to look for and how to be a savvy customer then they’d be able to discern good marketers from bad more often.
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Mason

I enjoyed reading your post, Mark. It was spot on in most cases, and for the others, such as commissions and such I cannot agree on, seeing as how I don’t have a product, nor have I ever really become an affiliate. I do, however, have a list, and I struggle daily with what to send my list. I’m usually trying to find good information, or offer them a free PLR product I came across as a way of saying ‘thanks for being on my list’. While I do want to start sending affiliate offers to my list, and eventually get around to creating my own products, I’ll just sit back and offer free stuff, because I’m quite honestly afraid of losing my subscribers and treating them like another number.

On another note, where have you, Mark, and Shane been selling other than the WF? I’m interested to find other avenues to market for my eventual release :D. Also, congrats on all the comments! This is my first visit to your blog, and I’m very impressed. I’ll definitely be back!
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Mark
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Mason, Thanks for taking time to comment.

I personally sell to my list, I create products that they want and that accounts for 80% of my sales. If you have a look at the sidebar you’ll see a report called 500 buyers, that pretty much my philosophy.

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sugianto saputra

Wow… good points !

hahaha… just caught as one of them.

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Suzy

Good points you’ve listed there Mark!

As reading, (and I’m sure some long timers will agree), certain ‘Internet Marketer’ names just kept popping into my head whose email and activities on the internet matches the point you were discussing

Amazed that I know a different match for each point!

Crikey!

My comment is:
What about a point 8?

Those who have a support URL/contact email that’s not supported or worse when URL link clicked, taken to a blank page? For example, two weeks ago, I purchased a product by a famous Kindle expert offering a bonus replay webinar for buying through their affiliate link. I followed the bonus receiving instructions of including specific words in my subject line. To-date still no response (my fingers are still tapping on my desk in rhythm waiting and waiting)

Sent 3 emails so far with zilch reply for link Instead got an email saying “Thanks for signing up2 Oh please

So I decided to look elsewhere online to locate them by their famous name

Found them on WF – monitoring their latest Kindle WSO

Sent PM and I’m still waiting (Yes the green circle ‘currently online’ status was displayed beside their name)

It’s not the first time neither with being ignored by so call after sales support/contact email

Just an observation of a missing point: No after care support (Feels like: “I got your money Now p*** off”)

Thanks for posting Mark

Suzy

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Stuart

I think your point about OTO’s in the WSO area of the Warrior Forum is bang on. I can’t even believe how much I dislike that practice. If there is something that can make the WSO a better product, put it in the damn product!

Another that I have zero respect for is buying a product but not being able to access it until I have joined the marketer’s list. Can you imagine going into a shop, paying for something but not being allowed to take it out of the store until they have your name and address? Imagine going into McDonalds and ordering and paying and not getting the fries until they had your contact info. There would be a revolution if that happened!
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John Lenaghan

I agree with most of your points Mark, but I sometimes wonder if I feel this way because I’ve been around long enough to recognize a lot of this stuff. I wonder if people who are entering the market with fresh eyes feel the same, or if it takes a while for some of these things to become annoying.

The point about the most common WSO question being “is there an OTO” is kind of amusing. I wonder if those people also preface their orders at McDonalds with “are you going to ask me if I want a larger size after I order?”

Upselling has been around as long as selling. There are scammy ways to do it, like leaving something out of the main product that requires you to buy the upsell, but the practice itself is perfectly acceptable.

The fact that is has such a bad name on the Warrior Forum (and in the IM market in general) just goes to show that people have been using it poorly.
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Mark
Twitter:
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John, what really surprises me is that a lot of the people who ask about OTO’s have a very low post count and it tends to be the same people all the time.. almost like it’s an obsession with them

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Jack Coxill

Awesome post Mark! I completely agree with you on the fact that people seem to just follow others and copy them, rather than use methods and systems in their own way to the best of their ability. The amount of offers I receive daily from either the same product or products which may as well BE the same product is ridiculous, and only 10% of which look half decent..

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Shanna Carson

Interesting post and I have also enjoyed all the tought-provoking comments. 🙂

I think that IM is far from being dead. Internet marketing is much larger than shady gurus and busy IM forums. It involves giant businesses such as Amazon, Best Buy, Zappos and many other businesses that are selling their products online.

That being said, the crazy era where crowds of IMers are just selling IM products to other IMers may be close to the end. That specific form of marketing is becoming synonym of scam, and yes, we may call it a suicide.

So many people believe that they will become rich while working 4 hours per week and selling crappy products. The truth is that IM is a profession, not a path to quick and easy riches.

I have to disagree regarding affiliate marketing only being a short term source of income. I have earned a consistent income since 2008 as an affiliate marketer in a niche related to children and babies. I believe that I helped bringing value to the lives of thousands of people. There are many store owners who sell products they didn’t create themselves, but they are still operating a full-fledged business in my opinion. Why should it be different in the online world?
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Darryl

Great post, a little late reading it and forgive me if someone has already mentioned this issue. The big thing that annoys me about these massive launches is that these promoters GIVE away their products as bonuses that I paid good money for a few months earlier! Gee, thanks guys! I still work a day job and work very hard for the $$$. I guess the good thing is that I realized that they really don’t care about their subscribers and perhaps their “bonus” products really weren’t worth the money. Off their list for me!

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